Джейн Остин и балы

а что такое "Переубеждение"? неужели вариант перевода "Доводов рассудка"?

в оригинале "Persuasion"

погуглила: есть варианты перевода названия "Убеждение" и "Доводы рассудка", встречаются в равных пропорциях. просто я читала именно со вторым вариантом названия. какие все-таки выдумщики эти переводчики

"Доводы рассудка" - оно со одной строны хорошо, но как-то хочется, если в оригинале одно слово, то одним словом и в переводе обойтись. Конечно, такого строгого правила нет, но это же название, у него своя магия. А "Убеждение" - мне показалось этого мало, исходя из содержания книги. "Переубеждение" мне тоже не до конца нравится, но из трех вариантов, кажется, все-таки адекватнее.

Дякую, дуже цікаво :)
Можеш перекласти фрагмент з вмістом прецеденту?

ну вот, а я так надеялась, что про подробности никто не спросит ;)

и я, и я прошу цитату!

ни вот, придется раскрывать карты :)
Да, да, там очень специфические обстоятельства и специфический кавалер. Но факт остается фактом. Она приглашает его :) Читайте:

The two first dances were not quite over when the returning sound of carriages after a long interruption called general notice, and "The Osbornes are coming! The Osbornes are coming!" was repeated round the room. After some minutes of extraordinary bustle without and watchful curiosity within, the important party, preceded by the attentive master of the inn to open a door which was never shut, made their appearance. They consisted of Lady Osborne; her son, Lord Osborne; her daughter, Miss Osborne; Miss Carr, her daughter's friend; Mr. Howard, formerly tutor to Lord Osborne, now clergyman of the parish in which the castle stood; Mrs. Blake, a widow sister who lived with him; her son, a fine boy of ten years old; and Mr. Tom Musgrave, who probably, imprisoned within his own room, had been listening in bitter impatience to the sound of the music for the last half-hour. In their progress up the room, they paused almost immediately behind Emma to receive the compliments of some acquaintance; and she heard Lady Osborne observe that they had made a point of coming early for the gratification of Mrs. Blake's little boy, who was uncommonly fond of dancing. Emma looked at them all as they passed, but chiefly and with most interest on Tom Musgrave, who was certainly a genteel, good-looking young man. Of the females, Lady Osborne had by much the finest person; though nearly fifty, she was very handsome, and had all the dignity of rank.

Lord Osborne was a very fine young man; but there was an air of coldness, of carelessness, even of awkwardness about him, which seemed to speak him out of his element in a ball-room. He came, in fact, only because it was judged expedient for him to please the borough; he was not fond of women's company, and he never danced. Mr. Howard was an agreeable-looking man, a little more than thirty.

At the conclusion of the two dances, Emma found herself, she knew not how, seated amongst the Osborne set; and she was immediately struck with the fine countenance and animated gestures of the little boy, as he was standing before his mother, wondering when they should begin.

"You will not be surprised at Charles' impatience," said Mrs. Blake, a lively, pleasant-looking little woman of five or six and thirty, to a lady who was standing near her, "when you know what a partner he is to have. Miss Osborne has been so very kind as to promise to dance the two first dances with him."

"Oh, yes! we have been engaged this week," cried the boy, "and we are to dance down every couple."

On the other side of Emma, Miss Osborne, Miss Carr, and a party of young men were standing engaged in very lively consultation; and soon afterwards she saw the smartest officer of the set walking off to the orchestra to order the dance, while Miss Osborne, passing before her to her little expecting partner, hastily said: "Charles, I beg your pardon for not keeping my engagement, but I am going to dance these two dances with Colonel Beresford. I know you will excuse me, and I will certainly dance with you after tea"; and without staying for an answer, she turned again to Miss Carr, and in another minute was led by Colonel Beresford to begin the set. If the poor little boy's face had in its happiness been interesting to Emma, it was infinitely more so under this sudden reverse; he stood the picture of disappointment, with crimsoned cheeks, quivering lips, and eyes bent on the floor. His mother, stifling her own mortification, tried to soothe his with the prospect of Miss Osborne's second promise; but though he contrived to utter, with an effort of boyish bravery, "Oh, I do not mind it!" it was very evident, by the unceasing agitation of his features, that he minded it as much as ever.

Это присказка, а вот само приглашение:

Emma did not think or reflect; she felt and acted. "I shall be very happy to dance with you, sir, if you like it," said she, holding out her hand with the most unaffected good-humour. The boy, in one moment restored to all his first delight, looked joyfully at his mother; and stepping forwards with an honest and simple "Thank you, ma'am," was instantly ready to attend his new acquaintance. The thankfulness of Mrs. Blake was more diffuse; with a look most expressive of unexpected pleasure and lively gratitude, she turned to her neighbour with repeated and fervent acknowledgments of so great and condescending a kindness to her boy. Emma, with perfect truth, could assure her that she could not be giving greater pleasure than she felt herself; and Charles being provided with his gloves and charged to keep them on, they joined the set which was now rapidly forming, with nearly equal complacency. It was a partnership which could not be noticed without surprise. It gained her a broad stare from Miss Osborne and Miss Carr as they passed her in the dance. "Upon my word, Charles, you are in luck," said the former, as she turned him; "you have got a better partner than me"; to which the happy Charles answered "Yes."

переводить нету времени, а сам фрагмент читай ниже *вздох* :)

Забавно, не далее как сегодня читала обсуждение этого в рассылке. :)

Там отмечали несколько интересных моментов:
1. По сути, станцевать два танца подряд было одним из немногих способов пообщаться на балу, т.к. в Англии было принято паузы между танцами (да и пропущенные танцы) проводить в однополом кругу (что для английского общества с его клубами весьма и весьма характерно). А между двумя танцами человек не расставался с партнером, и, естественно, с ним общался.
2. до сих пор в некоторых областях Англии есть традиция: пары танцуют два танца подряд с небольшим перерывом (буквально минута - чтобы объявить следующий танец), а затем все уходят с танцпола, и перед следующей парой танцев перерыв уже больше - минут пять.

А что у Остин написано о последних двух танцах? Я помню только цитаты о важности первых двух - на них приглашали или того, кого обязаны были пригласить, или того, с кем более всего хотели танцевать. (Это очень хорошо видно в Менсфилд-парке, к примеру.)

о, спасибо за уточнения! Неплохо было бы на балу отыграть "однополые круги" - у Остин это тоже часто описывается.

Про два последние танца: вот такой разговор из вышеупомянутого текста навёл меня намысль, что и они тоже важны:

"How came you not to dance with either of the Mr. Tomlinsons, Mary?" said her mother.

"I was always engaged when they asked me."

"I thought you were to have stood up with Mr. James the two last dances; Mrs. Tomlinson told me he was gone to ask you, and I had heard you say two minutes before that you were not engaged."

"Yes, but there was a mistake; I had misunderstood. I did not know I was engaged. I thought it had been for the two dances after, if we stayed so long; but Captain Hunter assured me it was for those very two."

"So you ended with Captain Hunter, Mary, did you?" said her father. "And whom did you begin with?"

"Captain Hunter," was repeated in a very humble tone.

Т.е. получается, что она с одним и тем же партнером танцевала 2+2 танца за вечер? А в каких они отношениях между собой на момент бала?

она - незамужняя девица, он - red coat. Вот вам и отношения :)
Не помолвлены.

Думаю, важность обуславливается еще и Финальным танцем - самым располагающим к общению.

Просто в других книгах Остин об этом ничего нигде не говорилось.

скажи, ты не знаешь случайно - полковнику на балу обязательно быть в мундире?

к сожалению, не знаю :(